We're working hard on v2c4m4 but I want to start thinking ahead to chapter 5. I'm going to try to keep the spoilers as general as I can but there will be large amounts of them.
Let's review how it worked in v1 first.
You were arrested as you passed through the mines of Corsix and put into prison. Your harem was transferred to a holding pen. Each night the main character had visitors to where he was being kept but couldn't actively participate in his fate. Instead, each day an individual slave was let out into the town of Corsix and tried to find a way to make a juror vote innocent for you. And since Harem is porn it involved them having sex with different people in different ways to get their vote.
I would say more than any other piece of content in Harem the Corsix segment had wildly divergent reviews. I've had more comments that this was their absolutely favorite segment because it turned the focus exclusively on the slaves than any other part of v1. Really the only time in the game that you saw their characters not through the filters of your own actions. Other people hated it passionately as it involved other people having sex with their women. Other people enjoyed as it was a much more story focused experience where the scenes came to you in a specified order. Other people hated it for the exact same reason. Nearly everyone thought that it was really hard to figure out what to do with each slave (and that I agree with).
Before I throw the doors open, there are a few things which must happen in chapter 5 for chapter 6 to happen.
1. Your player will be imprisoned in the start of chapter and the player will act through the slaves.
2. Some of your slaves will be removed at the end of chapter 5.
2a. This will be temporary. EVERY slave that's taken away will be recovered. Mostly in chapter 6, but that's not itself guaranteed.
3. When you leave Corsix, it won't be the 4 character only party that it was in v1. Anyone that doesn't have to be removed for a story arc will be available, but are unlikely to receive any speaking roles for a while afterwards.
addendum:
4. I will be improving the guidance dramatically. Each slave will have an inner monologue as they leave the pens hinting what the slave should do. And I'll be updating the mechanical guide that will tell you explicitly what needs to be done.
5. All the content will be rewritten/improved as the prior chapters have been.
So now I'd like to throw the topic open for discussion. How do YOU want to see chapter 5 play out this time around? How would you like me to change it this time around? Although keep in mind that the more alternative options I add, the slower development will be. I'm expecting chapter 5 to be a 2-3 month series of releases, where you can only do 2-3 days per release with a limited selection of slaves.
I know I mentioned this before, but have you considered allowing the ability to play as all of your party members, instead of having the player choose certain members like in version one?
ReplyDeleteHmm. What I could do is let the player uncap the end of it. You'll have to play through 7 parts to get to the trial, but there would be an option to continue doing those quests even after you've 'proved' your innocence.
DeleteDoes that sound like a good idea?
As a completionist, I like the idea. In Version 1 I made several saves so I could see every story, not having to do that this time around would be nice. Also, here's an idea, the people you help prior the trial repay your assistance by vouching for you at the trial. But those you help AFTER the trial could owe you a different favour, like help with a quest, gold, a minor slave, etc.
DeleteSo after the events of chapter 6 in v1 I always planned for the player to be able to backtrack and see the consequences for their actions beforehand.
DeleteI've played my Hero pretty much as a good guy the whole way, he took possession of Terra's soul though so I'm curious how that will play out, I remember last time she betrayed him fairly quickly and I'd hate to see that happen again just because he controls her soul...yeah I know how that sounds lol
ReplyDelete4m2 reconciles Terra to path. So by the time that you get to Corsix both of the paths have straightened out to some degree.
DeleteWait, so does that mean the plot no longer revolves specifically around that character in Episode 6? Also, while I only just started playing V2 now and haven't finished yet, is there a Neutral Route implemented now, or is the game still Good/Bad only?
DeleteWhile Terra will always be plot relevant, the focus of the game will shift to the Melony/Betsy/Danielle/Teresa group as we go into chapter 7.
DeleteUltimately Terra forces the question: What is going on in this world and how are the divines and spirits involved? Chapter 6 will give a broad (although incorrect) answer to that question which will slide the focus off of the question (Terra) and onto the answer(s).
There isn't a neutral route so far. Ultimately chapter 5 is a branch point in the story and I need to player to go down one route or another. But I might add in the ability to gravitate back to the center afterwards, I'm not 100% sure.
Deletethe things i hated back in v1 trial content:
ReplyDelete1. the girls have to whore themselves (cheat on the main character with other guys) while the main character can do nothing to stop it. it would be nice to either have the options to get the inocent verdict through non sexual quests as well (like battles and such [similarly to the quests in the minor releases would be nice i really love those]) that way at least the cheating wouldn't feel forced and both players who enjoy the cheating and the players who don't will be able to enjoy the story
2. the timer. i am a pretty slow reader so in order to succeed the quests (ghetting the inocent votes) i had to skip on all the cutscenes. a good idea would be to have the timer stop during dialouges and cutscenes so slow readers like me will be able to engoy/read the story instead of feeling forced to skip it and feeling like i missed almost an entire chapter
3. the city was really huge with not enough guidelines or signs on where to go.the first time i played that part it took me nearly 10 minutes with each girl to find out where i needed to go. either put signs in the city to guide the player for the names & locations of the places in the city. or make the city smaller.
4. the thing i hated the most in this section was the fact that both the main character and the girls worked so much to get the inocent verdict only to give up all the girls for that greedy pig for mony without even the option to get/buy them back as a player it socked me and felt completely unfair. at least i hope that this time around we'll get to keep most if not all the girls we worked so hard to get even if they won't talk or have any scenes for a while.
what i loved about the trial part in v1:
1. the caracter development for most girls like cecilia and rhea was nice
2. got to see some more of cindy
3. what i loved the most was the parts of the main character they were well written and without time prssuere so even a slow reader like me could enjoy them
4. got to fuck venessa, jessica anael (the angel) and isabela again. i really loved those scenes
5. getting nicole finally into the harem
note: i only ever play the light path so treat all the things i said accordingly
i have a question:
1. why in v2 we didn't get to fuck isabela in solemn tower back in chapter 4? even with terra's investigative scene we should have been able to fuck her after all even in v1 we didn't get her into the harem until v1.6b
One of the things I'm considering is having a non-fucking route through it. It's a question of what kind of quality it would be and a balance of time. Would you prefer another unique questline for each slave and extend development of ch5 for another month or two or just a series of 7 linear ones to let us get past the content?
Delete2. The timer will be gone. Already decided
3. Guidance will improve.
4. The plot requires a few of the slaves to take a vacation from you. But it will only be a few and not for that long!
Question: When I was looking at the first Isabella scene from v1 it was one of the most illogical scenes in the entire thing. Ralph's dialogue made no sense, revealing things he had absolutely no ability to know. Ultimately I decided to leave Isabella as a mystery to want rather than giving the player a taste then and there. But no worries, that's a piece of ass you'll get on both routes :)
I defenately prefer a uniqe quests for each character
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteInstead of a non-fucking route, how about a lesbian route?
DeleteGood idea, I'll try to add a few scenes like that.
DeleteHonestly so far I enjoy it all and I am looking forward to chapter 5. But just like martin said being able to do the rest of the slaves events would be nice.
ReplyDeleteI would like to suggest some little touches for polish that make the experience of each slave different; maybe random NPCs in the street react differently to, say, Kathleen (Elan) or Noemi and Naitay (Cheli) than the others. Maybe they recognize Fiona and are shocked to see her in slavery. Perhaps you might even sneak in some hidden scenes for some slaves in order to encourage exploration and make the gameplay more compelling than just Point A to Point B linearity.
ReplyDeleteFor example maybe there is a back alley somewhere in Corsix that is known to have a bad reputation. You can put a rapist in there that every girl can either fight or automatically fall victim to (if they are non-combat) and get a scene out of it. The scene can vary slightly for each slave, and some slaves can get a much more unique experience in the alley. These kinds of encounters can sort of be the equivalent of the side quests in Chapter 4.
My main point here is that you should make Corsix feel alive with plenty of things to do and see for every slave, and where you can, make each slave's experience and perspective different. I think that's the best way to maximize the unique structure of Chapter 5. It could be really special.
Very much agreed. Not sure if every NPC will be getting unique dialogue, but a few of the characters that become more important in chapter 6 and beyond will be getting a lot more face time, and all in talking to your current harem.
DeleteI didn't have v1 one but I remember this part I liked it alot as it was an intresting turn of events (I had v 0.6b.8 until I found v2c4m1.4) I agree that their little speech spot about what to do was abit cryptic at some and too blantent at others the one that gave the most trouble was terra but not sure how you'd fix hers as she wasn't even looking for the area she went to as she said she felt an energy when she got close to it from what I remember. I did both the light and dark path I like the idea you had of having your actions toward their girls due to it affecting their attitude it effects their preformance and actions when working with the people edwin really pissed me off as him and I thhink one or two others did nothing that helped maybe you should add an extra day or two to fix that or give something that hints toward the likely hood of what happens (I understand why you had that happen with edwin just got annoyed) thwe timer on some points made it have countless times to finish (i cant remember who had that though) something I think would be intresting would be to have more playable parts in the girls stories getting help for example Samantha could have to figure out what the audience wants to hear based on whats being said (not sure how well that would work just an example) or maybe angelica having to make some potions that you have to collect the regants could have multiple types ld make depending on what she is going to do with it or to give to someone specific something like that would be intresting and lead to more fun in the area of the game of course these are just my thoughts on what I saw
ReplyDeleteThe Corsix trial was absolutely the best part of the v1. It was such a unique feature that I had not seen for 20+ years of RPG or hentai gaming. If anything, I would recommend keeping the way you had it! Now, if you want to change it, here are some suggestions:
ReplyDelete1. Each girl should get an opportunity to whore herself out, meaning the number of days should not be less than the number of girls you have in your harem. Maybe make the pre-trial period = number of slaves you have?
2. I disagree with the idea that whoring your girls is bad since the whole concept of the game is to eventually sell them or use them as bargaining chips back at your homeland. If anything, how the girls choose to whore themselves should determine their final disposition back at your homeland. For example, if Samantha is successful in her quest, she will become a lady and get married to a high noble in the end; if she fails, she ends up being sold to a merchant as a trophy wife. This way, depending on how we see each girl and the roles they play, we can choose the outcome of their story.
3. What I disliked about v1 was that I felt like I lost control of the story in chapter 6, and it began in chapter 5. While it was good to focus the story on the girls and develop them further, it was important to bring the story back to the hero in chapter 6. I think the good and evil paths in v1 diverged so much in chapter 6 that it became a burden to you as a developer, because you were basically writing 2 different games at that point, instead of 1 story with 2 different narrative. Ultimately, I believe that added burden was what caused you to lose interest with v1. In chapter 6, the stories diverged so much that I could not see how you could have brought the 2 paths together and into Rata, where the ocean faring boat is supposed to be available. Therefore, in order to avoid the pitfall of taking on something too ambitious than you find yourself unwilling to take on, I would be careful with how you conclude the events in chapter 5.
Been a long time since i played it but what i love about most off this game is the open world feeling and there is notting of that in the trial part off the game( not a game from my point off view, but a short story). When the setup is based on so much story and time played its hard to know remeber what the background is.
ReplyDeleteAnd i do agree with "war" that anything timed have to be when there is no tekst.
So more open options to how to save the hero all from a trial to hack and slash but make it the players option not your choice.
I haven't played version 1, but form the comments i know what the hero is faceing. I think it would be a good idea for angel and demon to vist him when hes in jail and explane a bit more about the threat to the world and his own Homeland. They could also try to to persuade the hero to embrace one of their points of view. Also i would like a mothernand daughter combo in the game. Also i would like the hero to plan to get his harem back soon after there taken away. And for the ending the Hero should be able to chose which girls he wants for his bride and mistresses.
ReplyDeleteI really wasn't a fan of the trial in v1 it was too much like cutscenes in conventional games (i.e character is screwed over in a situation that they would have won/beaten if it had been a playable section).
ReplyDeleteI usually played both paths but only really played the dark to see the variations in story (didn't really think much of the dark side hero). On both paths though no matter the verdict it felt like the hero losses, Terra ends up in the hands of the fanatical religion you lose your harem, etc. You are the hero you're meant to beat your enemy get the girl and ride off victoriously into the sunset so I wasn't a fan of how the trial ended.
I didn't really mind the fact that the girls used sex to secure votes, though it seemed forced for a few of them as it went against their personality. Perhaps some dialogue to show their determination to do whatever it takes to save the hero? Didn't one of the voters betray your slave and vote against you anyway despite being "persuaded"? (though it's been a while since I played v1 and might be remembering wrong) if so it would be nice this time around if their efforts weren't in vain or some kind of binding agreement rather then having to trust the voters word like a token or something.
I used the walkthrough for v1 so I didn't really have a problem finding my way around but your plans for better directions is helpful.
As for adding more girls to the chapter (so you play the path of all your slaves) i'm undecided about, in v1 I mostly just wanted the trial over and done with ASAP so I didn't mind only play ing as the few, so depending on how the trial is done this time I may feel different. Shouldn't be a problem though v2 has been really good so far and will continue to be.
I found that the harem having sex with other men is a a turn off, which is most of the original chapter 5.
ReplyDeleteI would definitely appreciate more opportunities for the girls to secure votes through lesbian seduction.
Really great feedback in this line!
ReplyDeleteI liked the original trial! Sure, the sidequests where the girls whored themselves out were sometimes kinda depressing, particularly Noemi's and even the optional part of Terra's, but I think it's a bit exaggerated how many girls actually do.
ReplyDeleteOff the top of my head, Terra can just go to the garden and talk to the priestess, Phoebe just spanks an old guy in dominatrix gear, and the pink-haired chick is just revealing her true colors. And I don't remember Sarah's that well, but wasn't she able to sneak through part of it?
And even then, some of the other stories were a bit "softer." I normally don't like cheating stories, and I don't even like Sam that much, but her trial storyline was actually really well-done, in terms of how it's presented to the audience. Then again, this one's probably going to mention her fiancee a bit more... Also, I liked Donna's a lot.
I guess, with a few exceptions, by using the save feature I was able to figure out which girls didn't have to whore themselves out to assholes for a quick vote, and it's *that* kinda thing, rather than just the girls sleeping around, that would've bothered me.
Count this as another vote for uncapping the girls. As I recall, almost every girl who went out advanced her own story, and though there was no indication of it beforehand, there were a few who needed to go out to advance their stories (off the top of my head, in the light route, Terra, Angelica, Cindy, and Rhea all fell in that category) and it was possible to miss them because of the cap.
ReplyDeleteIf the girls' deeds are going to make a difference for them beyond the end of the trial, either the cap has to go or you're going to have to plot for several dozen possible combinations, at least.
I played the light side of the trial and really enjoyed it. It sounds like you're already hitting the mechanical aspects (time limit, girl cap, lack of direction) I had problems with. However, the entire time I was playing this section I was wondering why the hero never tried to simply claim they weren't slaves, just "traveling companions," and get off scott free since there wasn't really any physical evidence they were slaves on the light side. At the very end you get Angelica because she claims exactly this and I was left wondering why more of the girls or the Hero didn't try it.
ReplyDeleteThere's ways to get around it or lampshade why that wouldn't work but leaving it unaddressed like it was seemed like a railroaded story straight into a plot hole.
Why would they? Your power has changed their minds. Slavery is normal in this land and they're proud to be your slave. They think it's proper and appropriate that they call you master and proudly tell people that fact. You've had to stop them from doing so on a few different occasions.
DeleteThe unit in Corsix already has a pretty decent amount of knowledge about Ralph and his travels, as evidenced by them knowing what happened in Lesser Corsix at all. I imagine there is a good shot the Namhurists already told the unit they were all unregistered slaves.
ReplyDeleteAngelica, didn't leave because wasn't registered. She left because she brought of family relationships.
Still, it might be a good idea for there to be a throwaway line where one of the slaves claims not to be a slave and they get shot down because the Corsix unit isn't stupid?
didn't ralph have the power of the ring can't he just teleport back to the hideout with his followers except of course that his magic was sealed or blocked by someone
ReplyDeleteThe hearthstone is taken from you in the beginning of chapter 5
Deleteafter all the journey after all the conquest the mighty hero can't even win against law didn't he have many capable companion under his command also ralph is the scheming type it is unlike him to get tricked and used by other people also he is strong right he killed the tentacle king monster and drove their tribe away from the surface after all the great hero ralph is so weak that he cannot win against a trial just to prove his innocence pretty absurd honestly
ReplyDeleteIt's likely that there won't be a way to fail the trial in version 2. Both for what you say and to minimize story variants.
DeleteI've not played v1, it may be irrelevant but there is a common flaw in many RPG. In these RPG you grow stronger and stronger, defeat more and more powerfull opponent, but somehow only a few guards are enough to arrest you...
ReplyDeleteIn Harem, in grind my way, so my strong enough to take down an entire regiment.
By the way, when i went to the orc campment to rescue Angelica, i read i can either do a frontal assault or send two performer to scout. I was thinking, my party was strong enough to went in the direct way, no need to wast time to foment a ruse. But i my walktrought, i had no choice, i had to go back to the town to look for Cecilla. Is this because, I was too far in the light path ?
"Other people hated it passionately as it involved other people having sex with their women"...sorry but this is just stupid, you shouldn't even listen to this kind of comments. To be honest you should have integrated that kind of gameplay (using the girls in first person) in OTHER acts, it renders the game far more varied and interesting (and exciting). That's the main reason I don't feel like this game is evolving the right way. Sorry but I hope you'll appreciate my honesty.
ReplyDelete